Curse

Flem · Feb 14, 2008, 06:26 PM // 18:26

9/10 for Obama

Abonai Laguna · Feb 14, 2008, 06:55 PM // 18:55

9-10 obama. but he just rules, a black person in the WHITE house.

Flem · Feb 14, 2008, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abonai Laguna

9-10 obama. but he just rules, a black person in the WHITE house.

Which option did you disagree on him with? My was war. I think the troops should be taken out right now.

lakatz · Feb 14, 2008, 08:31 PM // 20:31

I got 9-10 for Obama as well... which means he and I have a similar belief system. But what one believes in has nothing to do with what one can do.

He's eloquent. He's charismatic. But he has no experience. He's in his first term as a Senator... not second term... or not following a stint as Governor even. And since he's been campaigning for President he (and the other two primary candidates) hasn't even worked much as a Senator.

If you were to look at the candidates' resumes (Obama's) before seeing and hearing them... without knowing their names, I bet big bucks you wouldn't even let Obama through the door. Besides the fact there's no experience on it, there's also a four year gap (EDIT: actually this was after his affair with hard drugs which was during his teen, not during this time).

He's a huge risk for any position and a risk I'm not willing to take for as important a job as the Presidency... just because we share beliefs.

Flem · Feb 14, 2008, 09:00 PM // 21:00

Sounds like you've been digesting too much of Hilary's rhetoric.

lakatz · Feb 14, 2008, 10:56 PM // 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flem

Sounds like you've been digesting too much of Hilary's rhetoric.

You missed the obvious. AND... you either haven't read this thread or you have short memory issues. I don't fall for ANYONE's rhetoric. That's my point. It's the same point I've made in others threads as well.

In this thread:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...4&postcount=10
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...6&postcount=20

And to quote myself in another thread: "My mother taught me to never take a politician at their word."

I'm just old enough to know the value of experience. It's that simple.

Flem · Feb 15, 2008, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by lakatz

You missed the obvious. AND... you either haven't read this thread or you have short memory issues. I don't fall for ANYONE's rhetoric. That's my point. It's the same point I've made in others threads as well.

In this thread:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...4&postcount=10
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...6&postcount=20

And to quote myself in another thread: "My mother taught me to never take a politician at their word."

I'm just old enough to know the value of experience. It's that simple.

Ok, experience is a good thing. BUT, what your experiencing makes all the dif.

She's never been president either. All it really takes it great leadership and great views. The rest of learn as you go.

1.) Hilary may make a decent leader, but she would be an extremely uncompasionate leader. She thinks of the numbers and doesn't seem to see us as people sometimes. Just numbers.

2.) Also, she could have 30 years of experience as even the President, but that's not gonna make her views make any more logical sence. She's the most conservative democrat in many many years. I agree with her about 20%of the time, and barely. And we all know that politicians lie, so put into practice, that's about a 5% approval rating from me....

lakatz · Feb 15, 2008, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flem

Ok, experience is a good thing. BUT, what your experiencing makes all the dif.

She's never been president either. All it really takes it great leadership and great views. The rest of learn as you go.

1.) Hilary may make a decent leader, but she would be an extremely uncompasionate leader. She thinks of the numbers and doesn't seem to see us as people sometimes. Just numbers.

2.) Also, she could have 30 years of experience as even the President, but that's not gonna make her views make any more logical sence. She's the most conservative democrat in many many years. I agree with her about 20%of the time, and barely. And we all know that politicians lie, so put into practice, that's about a 5% approval rating from me....

I haven't started on Hillary yet. I only finally voiced my reservations about Obama yesterday. And it's because I think he would be a big mistake. I really believe one has to get one's feet wet in Washington before wading out into deeper water rather than diving right into the deepest end.

You made points about Hillary I agree with and some I don't. One thing you didn't mention that I have trouble getting past is that she won't admit her initial yes vote giving Bush the authority to invade Iraq was a mistake. John Edwards finally did. But Hillary won't. She says she believed Bush when he said he would try weapons inspectors and diplomatic recourse first and that wasn't a mistake. I call bullsh*t on that.

Here's where I disagree with you about her. Without going into details, I was in a good vantage point to watch the Democratic National Committee push Bill Clinton for President. They started laying the groundwork way before the primaries and national convention. I would have been discouraged to watch this well orchestrated and very manipulative process, except for the fact these people were genuinely very excited about the prospect of having him in the White House. He had done a stellar job as Governor of Arkansas, and they knew the nation needed his talents.

They explained to me one of the reasons he was the best choice was the very reason you don't think Hillary is good choice... because he's a moderate. And he did prove that to be true. As much as we may want radical reform, it's much better to have a moderate in that position because they can get more support from across the aisle for their reforms than someone closer to either end of the political spectrum . And I have to say, anyone who believes Obama's rhetoric that he can get support from across the aisle for his far left dreams is beyond stupid. It just takes common sense to see that's not true. If he believes it himself, then I don't think he has the requisite common sense for that job. His charisma may work on us, but it won't work on his seasoned peers.

Btw, I could be wrong, but it looks like the DNC might be behind Hillary as well... with the change in her campaign manager from Patti Solis Doyle to Terry McAuliffe, former chair of the DNC.

One of the pluses I see in Hillary's column is that Bill Clinton is a strong economist and grew the nation's economy during his term. The economy was largely why he left office with a 65% approval rating, the highest since WWII. Our economy is in serious trouble right now, and I'd like Bill Clinton to be in an influential position to at least start the repair process which is going to take time to really repair after all the damage George W has done. Do not underestimate the influence Bill is going to have if Hillary wins the office.

I very much disagree with you about Hillary's level of compassion. She began her career in a very passionate pursuit, and I believe she's even more compassionate now than she was then. I don't believe we lose compassion as we get older. We get less "all about me" and more outward directed as we grow. I have.

About experience (and compassion), I so agree with Confucius (who didn't really enter government until after he was 50). He said he wished he had 50 more years because he didn't really get it until he was 50. We gain experience by making mistakes and learning from them. The more experienced a person is the fewer mistakes they make. Obama hasn't even begun to make his government career mistakes yet, and I certainly don't want him to start in the office of the President of the United States.